Analyzing Rate of Closure on Video
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Can you see if you have a high or low rate of closure on video?
Rate of closure has been a hot golf instruction topic for decades. This video answers a member question about the "look" of rate of closure on 2D video. It's better to look at the relationship BEFORE impact as opposed to after impact.
Video Transcript
WEBVTT
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In this analysis video, we're going to discuss the look of rate of closure.
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00:00:04.880 --> 00:00:09.860
So I've had a couple of questions about Sasha Mackenzie, Johnson-Claire
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presentation regarding
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the look of rate of closure.
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So I wanted to just do a quick video to kind of put in a couple of thoughts and
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give you
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a way that you can have a better way of looking at rate of closure on video.
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So historically, what a lot of guys have done is looked at two different points
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.
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So when the club's about parallel and the follow through and when the club is
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about
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parallel and the downswing, then basically advocating a certain look here in
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the follow
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through.
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Now, this is Phil Mickelson, flipped to a right hand golfer over here as Matt K
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uchar.
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You can see that they've got the club face pointed roughly in the same
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direction compared
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to the camera, golf balls started right of their target, so they were both kind
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of starting
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on a push trajectory.
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That means the club face is turned about the same amount between these two
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frames.
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Well, coming into impact, we're looking at their 3D's of Matt Kuchar as one of
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the lower
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rate of closures, and Phil Mickelson has one of the higher rate of closure.
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So this frame by itself doesn't give you enough to go off of.
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And there's a couple reasons that that might happen.
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One would be looking at contact location, so when you're looking at where the
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golf balls
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hit on the face compared to the COG, that can cause some funky twisting looks
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in the follow
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through.
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One other piece that might be relevant is in order to have a lower rate of
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closure at
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impact oftentimes golfers then are holding off or delaying the things that
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close the face.
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And so as a result, after impact, they have a rapid spike or a speed up in rate
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of closure,
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where oftentimes golfers who have a faster rate of closure at impact may have a
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look of
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a slower rate of closure after impact.
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And then lastly, the piece that we can't really tell from here is this is a 3D
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image.
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So we can look at the distance the club is away from where that T was.
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And often golfers who have the lower rate of closure have the later arc width.
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And so because their arms are extending more through the shot and the club is
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essentially
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working away from their body, the club may be further away, even though it's at
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the same
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angle, therefore it traveled a greater distance and therefore it moved a little
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bit slower.
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But one of the keys is, okay, this is a hard position right here in order to
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really look
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at rate of closure.
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So where do we want to look?
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The classic other position that I've heard discussed is looking pretty much at
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when the
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club is parallel to the ground or shaft parallel right around here.
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And you will see that if we look back at that position.
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So probably closest to this frame here, you will see that there's enough of a
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difference
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here right?
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Phil Mickelson's club is pointing above the horizon.
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Matt Cooches is already pointing down.
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So in order to get the club face to rotate a certain amount around the shaft,
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it's going
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to have to rotate less covering about the same distance so it's going to move
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slower.
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But I would challenge you to look even closer.
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So whether it's a foot before impact or basically it's close to impact as you
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can, seeing how
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early they get the face pointed roughly at the golf ball.
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So you'll see with Phil through this phase right through here, there's not a
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lot of club
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face rotation right through here.
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There's not a lot of club face rotation, so the club is still pointing well out
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to the
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right and then it's not until well down here that it starts to straighten and
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it's straightening
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more from a result of straightening that right arm rather than twisting the
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club with
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the wrist.
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And when you're doing it more from straightening that arm, you're going to tend
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to reach that
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low or widest point sooner, which is going to decrease the resistance to
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twisting and
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therefore it's going to twist much higher.
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So looking before impact, you can see that roughly when I've used when the club
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is in
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front of the right foot, if it's still pointing well out to the right, you're
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going to have
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a higher rate of closure.
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Alright, so one of the better places to look at rate of closure is looking at
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the face
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on view.
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Actually one of the best is the overhead view, but that one's really hard to
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come by unless
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you have your own studio and have a fair amount of pros.
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So from the face on view, you can basically look at about how much of the club
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face you
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can see.
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And you'll see over here with Phil, the club face really is apparent well into
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the downswing.
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So roughly when it's even with his trail foot, you can still see a fair amount
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of it.
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So now over here on the right, we've got Matt Coocher and you'll see that by
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that right
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foot, it's really rotating and pointing more at the golf ball.
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So right about here where it's even with the right foot, you can see pretty
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much the whole
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face.
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We're here, you can see a lot less of it.
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So he's already got it rotated towards the face or towards the golf ball, so
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then it's
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not going to have to rotate quite as much going into it.
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Phil on the other hand still has a fair amount of closing that he's going to
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have to do and
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he does it really in those last few frames.
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So even though they get to a similar look of club face rotation at that follow
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through
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position, they got there in very different ways.
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You can also see from this view, you can see more of that width aspect where he
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's reaching
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the widest point of his swing sooner.
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So when the down the line camera we're looking from this view here, the club is
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going to
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reach about the same height as Matt Coocher's would a little bit later and that
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can also
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kind of skew the look of how much the club face is actually rotated.
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So when you're trying to analyze club face rate of closure, you want to look at
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it just
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before impact, not after and sometimes down the line is a harder camera view to
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see rather
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than face on or overhead.
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Now here's a quick image to help with that idea of looking at the club after
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impact.
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Now these are amateurs hit on the swing vision and you'll see that when it's
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hit outside
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of the center of mass, it's going to cause a fair amount of club face rotation.
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So if you were to take a look at the image right about there, you might say
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that that
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was held open and therefore be slower, but if you were to look at this image
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here, it's
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still pointed fairly to the right.
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So my guess is that it's higher and unfortunately a lot of the golf swings that
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have a higher
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rate of closure tend to have more of a toe miss and therefore it's going to
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skew the
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look of it after impact.
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This would be more of the vertical gear effect from hitting it really low on
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the face.
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So now here we have Jim Furek, another lower rate of closure golfer and you'll
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see that
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he gets to a very different look here in the follow through than Matt Coocher
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did, but
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the rate of closure numbers are very similar.
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Now you can see that he gets the club through that key zone here pointing at
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the golf ball
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or closer to the target pretty early, it's not pointed out to the right quite
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as much.
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From this face on view, again by the time he gets even with that right foot,
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you'll
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see that the club is pointing more at the golf ball or more at the target so it
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's not
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going to have to rotate a ton through there.
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So I hope this helps you clarify the rate of closure discussion and how you can
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use video
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to identify.
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You're definitely not going to be able to get a numeric range as far as how
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fast you're
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actually closing, but you may be able to categorize yourself as more of a high
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rate, low rate,
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medium rate.
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So here's one last example.
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By looking at rate of closure in this way, you'll be able to understand why
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Jordan's
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beef has more of a medium rate of closure, he's not even really on the super
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low side,
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even though he has that kind of hold off look in the follow through that often
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gets attributed
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to a lower rate of closure.
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You can see that the club face is pointing a bit out to the right, not as much
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as Phil's,
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not as low as Furex or Kuchar, he's kind of more in the middle of the pack.
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From that face on view, you can still see a bit of the club face as it
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approaches more
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that right foot and then it closes there on the way through.
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So by using a more of a scientific or critical eye, hopefully you can
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understand a little
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bit better the rate of closure discussion.
1
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.880
In this analysis video, we're going to discuss the look of rate of closure.
2
00:00:04.880 --> 00:00:09.860
So I've had a couple of questions about Sasha Mackenzie, Johnson-Claire
3
00:00:09.860 --> 00:00:11.600
presentation regarding
4
00:00:11.600 --> 00:00:13.680
the look of rate of closure.
5
00:00:13.680 --> 00:00:19.930
So I wanted to just do a quick video to kind of put in a couple of thoughts and
6
00:00:19.930 --> 00:00:20.800
give you
7
00:00:20.800 --> 00:00:27.480
a way that you can have a better way of looking at rate of closure on video.
8
00:00:27.480 --> 00:00:31.670
So historically, what a lot of guys have done is looked at two different points
9
00:00:31.670 --> 00:00:31.960
.
10
00:00:31.960 --> 00:00:36.030
So when the club's about parallel and the follow through and when the club is
11
00:00:36.030 --> 00:00:36.440
about
12
00:00:36.440 --> 00:00:40.680
parallel and the downswing, then basically advocating a certain look here in
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00:00:40.680 --> 00:00:41.320
the follow
14
00:00:41.320 --> 00:00:42.320
through.
15
00:00:42.320 --> 00:00:47.090
Now, this is Phil Mickelson, flipped to a right hand golfer over here as Matt K
16
00:00:47.090 --> 00:00:47.600
uchar.
17
00:00:47.600 --> 00:00:51.610
You can see that they've got the club face pointed roughly in the same
18
00:00:51.610 --> 00:00:52.920
direction compared
19
00:00:52.920 --> 00:00:58.200
to the camera, golf balls started right of their target, so they were both kind
20
00:00:58.200 --> 00:00:58.720
of starting
21
00:00:58.720 --> 00:01:00.440
on a push trajectory.
22
00:01:00.440 --> 00:01:04.200
That means the club face is turned about the same amount between these two
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00:01:04.200 --> 00:01:04.840
frames.
24
00:01:04.840 --> 00:01:10.320
Well, coming into impact, we're looking at their 3D's of Matt Kuchar as one of
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the lower
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00:01:11.080 --> 00:01:15.640
rate of closures, and Phil Mickelson has one of the higher rate of closure.
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So this frame by itself doesn't give you enough to go off of.
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00:01:20.680 --> 00:01:23.400
And there's a couple reasons that that might happen.
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00:01:23.400 --> 00:01:29.820
One would be looking at contact location, so when you're looking at where the
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00:01:29.820 --> 00:01:30.800
golf balls
31
00:01:30.800 --> 00:01:35.660
hit on the face compared to the COG, that can cause some funky twisting looks
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00:01:35.660 --> 00:01:36.360
in the follow
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through.
34
00:01:37.680 --> 00:01:46.160
One other piece that might be relevant is in order to have a lower rate of
35
00:01:46.160 --> 00:01:47.440
closure at
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00:01:47.440 --> 00:01:52.510
impact oftentimes golfers then are holding off or delaying the things that
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00:01:52.510 --> 00:01:54.160
close the face.
38
00:01:54.160 --> 00:01:59.110
And so as a result, after impact, they have a rapid spike or a speed up in rate
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00:01:59.110 --> 00:02:00.080
of closure,
40
00:02:00.080 --> 00:02:05.330
where oftentimes golfers who have a faster rate of closure at impact may have a
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look of
42
00:02:05.920 --> 00:02:09.280
a slower rate of closure after impact.
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00:02:09.280 --> 00:02:14.140
And then lastly, the piece that we can't really tell from here is this is a 3D
44
00:02:14.140 --> 00:02:15.120
image.
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00:02:15.120 --> 00:02:20.080
So we can look at the distance the club is away from where that T was.
46
00:02:20.080 --> 00:02:24.480
And often golfers who have the lower rate of closure have the later arc width.
47
00:02:24.480 --> 00:02:30.780
And so because their arms are extending more through the shot and the club is
48
00:02:30.780 --> 00:02:31.960
essentially
49
00:02:31.960 --> 00:02:37.770
working away from their body, the club may be further away, even though it's at
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00:02:37.770 --> 00:02:38.320
the same
51
00:02:38.320 --> 00:02:42.200
angle, therefore it traveled a greater distance and therefore it moved a little
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bit slower.
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But one of the keys is, okay, this is a hard position right here in order to
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really look
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at rate of closure.
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00:02:50.680 --> 00:02:55.240
So where do we want to look?
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The classic other position that I've heard discussed is looking pretty much at
58
00:03:00.110 --> 00:03:00.480
when the
59
00:03:00.480 --> 00:03:07.600
club is parallel to the ground or shaft parallel right around here.
60
00:03:07.600 --> 00:03:12.240
And you will see that if we look back at that position.
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00:03:12.240 --> 00:03:17.840
So probably closest to this frame here, you will see that there's enough of a
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difference
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00:03:18.840 --> 00:03:19.840
here right?
64
00:03:19.840 --> 00:03:22.360
Phil Mickelson's club is pointing above the horizon.
65
00:03:22.360 --> 00:03:24.240
Matt Cooches is already pointing down.
66
00:03:24.240 --> 00:03:28.710
So in order to get the club face to rotate a certain amount around the shaft,
67
00:03:28.710 --> 00:03:29.440
it's going
68
00:03:29.440 --> 00:03:35.260
to have to rotate less covering about the same distance so it's going to move
69
00:03:35.260 --> 00:03:36.200
slower.
70
00:03:36.200 --> 00:03:39.680
But I would challenge you to look even closer.
71
00:03:39.680 --> 00:03:46.880
So whether it's a foot before impact or basically it's close to impact as you
72
00:03:46.880 --> 00:03:48.160
can, seeing how
73
00:03:48.160 --> 00:03:52.520
early they get the face pointed roughly at the golf ball.
74
00:03:52.520 --> 00:03:59.060
So you'll see with Phil through this phase right through here, there's not a
75
00:03:59.060 --> 00:03:59.900
lot of club
76
00:03:59.900 --> 00:04:02.560
face rotation right through here.
77
00:04:02.560 --> 00:04:06.280
There's not a lot of club face rotation, so the club is still pointing well out
78
00:04:06.280 --> 00:04:06.600
to the
79
00:04:06.600 --> 00:04:11.640
right and then it's not until well down here that it starts to straighten and
80
00:04:11.640 --> 00:04:12.520
it's straightening
81
00:04:12.520 --> 00:04:18.480
more from a result of straightening that right arm rather than twisting the
82
00:04:18.480 --> 00:04:19.320
club with
83
00:04:19.320 --> 00:04:20.720
the wrist.
84
00:04:20.720 --> 00:04:24.070
And when you're doing it more from straightening that arm, you're going to tend
85
00:04:24.070 --> 00:04:24.640
to reach that
86
00:04:24.640 --> 00:04:29.060
low or widest point sooner, which is going to decrease the resistance to
87
00:04:29.060 --> 00:04:29.920
twisting and
88
00:04:29.920 --> 00:04:34.240
therefore it's going to twist much higher.
89
00:04:34.240 --> 00:04:40.780
So looking before impact, you can see that roughly when I've used when the club
90
00:04:40.780 --> 00:04:41.200
is in
91
00:04:41.200 --> 00:04:45.470
front of the right foot, if it's still pointing well out to the right, you're
92
00:04:45.470 --> 00:04:46.280
going to have
93
00:04:46.280 --> 00:04:48.800
a higher rate of closure.
94
00:04:48.800 --> 00:04:53.870
Alright, so one of the better places to look at rate of closure is looking at
95
00:04:53.870 --> 00:04:54.520
the face
96
00:04:54.520 --> 00:04:55.520
on view.
97
00:04:55.520 --> 00:04:58.960
Actually one of the best is the overhead view, but that one's really hard to
98
00:04:58.960 --> 00:05:00.480
come by unless
99
00:05:00.480 --> 00:05:03.480
you have your own studio and have a fair amount of pros.
100
00:05:03.480 --> 00:05:07.620
So from the face on view, you can basically look at about how much of the club
101
00:05:07.620 --> 00:05:08.160
face you
102
00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:09.160
can see.
103
00:05:09.160 --> 00:05:15.020
And you'll see over here with Phil, the club face really is apparent well into
104
00:05:15.020 --> 00:05:15.880
the downswing.
105
00:05:15.880 --> 00:05:19.520
So roughly when it's even with his trail foot, you can still see a fair amount
106
00:05:19.520 --> 00:05:20.480
of it.
107
00:05:20.480 --> 00:05:25.440
So now over here on the right, we've got Matt Coocher and you'll see that by
108
00:05:25.440 --> 00:05:26.200
that right
109
00:05:26.200 --> 00:05:31.320
foot, it's really rotating and pointing more at the golf ball.
110
00:05:31.320 --> 00:05:35.240
So right about here where it's even with the right foot, you can see pretty
111
00:05:35.240 --> 00:05:35.920
much the whole
112
00:05:35.920 --> 00:05:36.920
face.
113
00:05:36.920 --> 00:05:39.840
We're here, you can see a lot less of it.
114
00:05:39.840 --> 00:05:44.030
So he's already got it rotated towards the face or towards the golf ball, so
115
00:05:44.030 --> 00:05:44.640
then it's
116
00:05:44.640 --> 00:05:47.840
not going to have to rotate quite as much going into it.
117
00:05:47.840 --> 00:05:51.670
Phil on the other hand still has a fair amount of closing that he's going to
118
00:05:51.670 --> 00:05:53.120
have to do and
119
00:05:53.120 --> 00:05:56.840
he does it really in those last few frames.
120
00:05:56.840 --> 00:06:01.840
So even though they get to a similar look of club face rotation at that follow
121
00:06:01.840 --> 00:06:02.440
through
122
00:06:02.440 --> 00:06:06.120
position, they got there in very different ways.
123
00:06:06.120 --> 00:06:11.880
You can also see from this view, you can see more of that width aspect where he
124
00:06:11.880 --> 00:06:12.440
's reaching
125
00:06:12.440 --> 00:06:15.960
the widest point of his swing sooner.
126
00:06:15.960 --> 00:06:21.620
So when the down the line camera we're looking from this view here, the club is
127
00:06:21.620 --> 00:06:22.280
going to
128
00:06:22.280 --> 00:06:27.960
reach about the same height as Matt Coocher's would a little bit later and that
129
00:06:27.960 --> 00:06:28.720
can also
130
00:06:28.720 --> 00:06:33.240
kind of skew the look of how much the club face is actually rotated.
131
00:06:33.240 --> 00:06:37.790
So when you're trying to analyze club face rate of closure, you want to look at
132
00:06:37.790 --> 00:06:38.240
it just
133
00:06:38.240 --> 00:06:43.840
before impact, not after and sometimes down the line is a harder camera view to
134
00:06:43.840 --> 00:06:44.680
see rather
135
00:06:44.680 --> 00:06:47.120
than face on or overhead.
136
00:06:47.120 --> 00:06:51.390
Now here's a quick image to help with that idea of looking at the club after
137
00:06:51.390 --> 00:06:52.160
impact.
138
00:06:52.160 --> 00:06:56.520
Now these are amateurs hit on the swing vision and you'll see that when it's
139
00:06:56.520 --> 00:06:57.600
hit outside
140
00:06:57.600 --> 00:07:03.800
of the center of mass, it's going to cause a fair amount of club face rotation.
141
00:07:03.800 --> 00:07:07.820
So if you were to take a look at the image right about there, you might say
142
00:07:07.820 --> 00:07:08.520
that that
143
00:07:08.520 --> 00:07:13.030
was held open and therefore be slower, but if you were to look at this image
144
00:07:13.030 --> 00:07:13.680
here, it's
145
00:07:13.680 --> 00:07:15.200
still pointed fairly to the right.
146
00:07:15.200 --> 00:07:20.060
So my guess is that it's higher and unfortunately a lot of the golf swings that
147
00:07:20.060 --> 00:07:20.920
have a higher
148
00:07:20.920 --> 00:07:27.070
rate of closure tend to have more of a toe miss and therefore it's going to
149
00:07:27.070 --> 00:07:27.920
skew the
150
00:07:27.920 --> 00:07:30.280
look of it after impact.
151
00:07:30.280 --> 00:07:36.160
This would be more of the vertical gear effect from hitting it really low on
152
00:07:36.160 --> 00:07:37.200
the face.
153
00:07:37.200 --> 00:07:43.340
So now here we have Jim Furek, another lower rate of closure golfer and you'll
154
00:07:43.340 --> 00:07:44.120
see that
155
00:07:44.120 --> 00:07:48.390
he gets to a very different look here in the follow through than Matt Coocher
156
00:07:48.390 --> 00:07:49.080
did, but
157
00:07:49.080 --> 00:07:52.440
the rate of closure numbers are very similar.
158
00:07:52.440 --> 00:07:57.060
Now you can see that he gets the club through that key zone here pointing at
159
00:07:57.060 --> 00:07:57.960
the golf ball
160
00:07:57.960 --> 00:08:02.740
or closer to the target pretty early, it's not pointed out to the right quite
161
00:08:02.740 --> 00:08:03.440
as much.
162
00:08:03.440 --> 00:08:07.550
From this face on view, again by the time he gets even with that right foot,
163
00:08:07.550 --> 00:08:08.080
you'll
164
00:08:08.080 --> 00:08:12.090
see that the club is pointing more at the golf ball or more at the target so it
165
00:08:12.090 --> 00:08:12.480
's not
166
00:08:12.480 --> 00:08:15.600
going to have to rotate a ton through there.
167
00:08:15.600 --> 00:08:20.550
So I hope this helps you clarify the rate of closure discussion and how you can
168
00:08:20.550 --> 00:08:22.240
use video
169
00:08:22.240 --> 00:08:23.680
to identify.
170
00:08:23.680 --> 00:08:26.930
You're definitely not going to be able to get a numeric range as far as how
171
00:08:26.930 --> 00:08:27.400
fast you're
172
00:08:27.400 --> 00:08:32.600
actually closing, but you may be able to categorize yourself as more of a high
173
00:08:32.600 --> 00:08:33.800
rate, low rate,
174
00:08:33.800 --> 00:08:34.800
medium rate.
175
00:08:34.800 --> 00:08:36.640
So here's one last example.
176
00:08:36.640 --> 00:08:41.010
By looking at rate of closure in this way, you'll be able to understand why
177
00:08:41.010 --> 00:08:41.680
Jordan's
178
00:08:41.680 --> 00:08:47.710
beef has more of a medium rate of closure, he's not even really on the super
179
00:08:47.710 --> 00:08:48.800
low side,
180
00:08:48.800 --> 00:08:53.390
even though he has that kind of hold off look in the follow through that often
181
00:08:53.390 --> 00:08:54.440
gets attributed
182
00:08:54.440 --> 00:08:56.320
to a lower rate of closure.
183
00:08:56.320 --> 00:08:59.420
You can see that the club face is pointing a bit out to the right, not as much
184
00:08:59.420 --> 00:09:00.080
as Phil's,
185
00:09:00.080 --> 00:09:05.840
not as low as Furex or Kuchar, he's kind of more in the middle of the pack.
186
00:09:05.840 --> 00:09:09.700
From that face on view, you can still see a bit of the club face as it
187
00:09:09.700 --> 00:09:10.840
approaches more
188
00:09:10.840 --> 00:09:14.840
that right foot and then it closes there on the way through.
189
00:09:14.840 --> 00:09:18.860
So by using a more of a scientific or critical eye, hopefully you can
190
00:09:18.860 --> 00:09:20.160
understand a little
191
00:09:20.160 --> 00:09:22.400
bit better the rate of closure discussion.
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